Hi Kahikateatree, Yep, I agree with most of your rat trap findings. You didn’t mention Doc200 which is certainly the best. takes no prisoners & even kills hedgehogs & possums. A24 I have one & am not very impressed. Don’t believe all the claims of kills. It’s only the amount of times the trap has been triggered that is counted not the actual kills. I have an A12 possum trap & am even less impressed .I believe it has now been discontinued. I’ve tried the Trapinator & like you find it useless. If you are having trouble with the Flipping Timmy you should persevere. It is by far the best possum trap on the market. Hold your hand on the top of the trap & pull the cord horizontally. That eliminates the friction that happens when you pull the cord upwards. To make it more possum attractive I set mine onto a sloping branch leaning from the ground to the trunk of the tree. The trap is about knee height. Hope this helps.
The can be A24 is effective in areas where there are large pest populations, if it’s in a good site and used properly (like all traps). For instance, if you were to extend your trapline, or start trapping in an area that isn’t receiving any pest control, it’s a good way to kill a lot pests quickly. Once the kill totals in an A24 start to drop, you replace it with single-kill traps to kill the predators that remain, suppressing their numbers. I’ve experienced this using my A24’s, and several studies have concluded that it’s a good trap for a first wave of control, but is sub-par afterwards. Presumably, the predators remaining are those that are wary about sticking their head inside the trap.
An A24’s kill totals could approximate those of conventional traps if they’re placed in remote areas that you aren’t able to visit very often and they eliminate the problem of re-luring traps and having to clean traps/tunnels that have had carcasses in them for a long time.
If you live in an urban area, and your neighbours don’t do any pest control, it’s a convenient trap to use, because there will be a constant supply of rats and mice seeking food and shelter, and pets will scavenge the carcasses.
The only way to know how many predators the A24 is actually killing when it fires, would be to use a trail cam.
I also have an A12, and it has racked up a few kills over the years, but it doesn’t perform any better than a Timms, IMO, but it is more convenient. It has been discontinued. My pair of Trapinators haven’t trapped a single possum yet. They’re highly-susceptible to lure theft by rodents and insects.
Thanks for the Flipping Timmy advice. FYI, feijoas are a good lure for Timms traps. Skewer a small, under-ripe one horizontally. Possums bite feijoas to determine how ripe they are, so even rock-hard feijoas will get some. I’ve also trapped rabbits and hares in Timms with feijoas in them, to my amazement. They should also be effective in cages.
Cheers.
Good to know it’s not just me being incompetent with them :-). The problem with my Flipping Timmy is that I’ve had to mount it fairly high up, around chest height, in the places I’ve had it because we’re on the boundary between a residential area and large area of native bush, there’s a walking track down there used by joggers and dog walkers and occasionally an overly-energetic hound will bound off the track and sniff around, I’d be traumatised if they stuck their head into a trap like that for some reason and set it off so I put them up out of reach.
Your photo also shows it more horizontal than vertical, which seems to confirm willowflat_warrior’s comments about them being reluctant to stick their head up vertically into things. I tested it about a year ago with the horizontal-access Timms next to the vertical-acccess Flipping Timmy and the latter was totally ignored… I’ll see if I can find a mostly-horizontal branch that extends up high enough that it’d be safe from over-enthusiastic pets.
I have had quite some success with Trapinators, Flipping Timmy’s and Flip-converted Timms, about head-high up trees. I use apple (about 1/6 apple-slice) as bait and smear apple (if still usable the old bait) onto the tree-bark up to the trap. The Trapinators also work well, but the bait-platform needs some modification. I screw one or two screws through (existing holes in) it, so that the apple can be spiked onto the platform which ends up hanging upside down. The success must be coming from the apple-scent up the tree and the fact that the possum will be trying to use his weight to pull the bait down. Servicing a Trapinator is so much easier because of the handle to set and release it. Give is another try!
We too are having plenty of success with trapinators in the Lewis Pass. Easy for volunteers as you say Roel, as well as suitable for areas with kea - important in the Lewis Pass.
Interesting discussion.
I LOVE Kness Big Snap E traps. I’ve caught a couple of hundred of rats around my house with them over the last 6 years.
The springs are super strong, they’re easy to set and bait with the rear bar - so you don’t have to touch the business end.
I set mine on 45 degree trees. This makes a huge difference. If I set them on a vertical tree - nothing. If I move them about 2m away to a sloping tree - bam - mulitple catches.
I do agree the bait is exposed to the elements. And they can be set off by heavy rain. And also occasionally I’ll catch a rat that has entered from above, so around it’s middle.
And by the way, they get hit behind the head - exactly where they should be - almost every time. I’m not sure why you think this doesn’t happen?
Some pics:
This is a 450mm rat:
Different rat, same tree, nice behind the neck capture:
Another one.
Regarding TRex’s: I quite like them, I’ve used quite a few inside wooden tunnels. I do tend to catch rats by the front legs with them sometimes…which I don’t like.
Regarding Trapinators: Yes I don’t think they’re that great. I imagine, like all tree mounted traps, most just walk past. Also, if you have branches near the bottom of the trap, the possums can push on those when they are caught, meaning they take ages to die. So you have to have them on a straight bit of tree.
Flipping Timmys: Yes, pull the cord when they are flipped open, then push up and secure with the red knob. This is easier. And I agree with others that on an angle will be better. But note that this trap and the Trapinator are NAWAC tested in the vertical position - as far as I know. Possums will die quicker with their weight pulling them down. If they’re on an angle, they’ll take longer to die.
So one interesting point that’s come up several times both here and in the other thread is the importance of putting them at 45 degrees or so rather than vertical. Anyone have any ideas why that would be the case? Looks like I’ll have to relocate the Flipping Timmy yet again once the rain stops, the downside is that all the trees within easy visual range are the vertical variety.
My 2 cents…
Flipping Timmies are my preferred possum catcher. I use Nutella (supermarket brand) which they love, although catches have been lower last spring when lots of trees were budding (depending on the area) although the numbers would have been lower from trapping. Prefeeding with some at the base of the tree helps. I think it’s a more humane kill due to the hanging nature or it rather than the possum rolling around on the ground with a box on its head. They pull the pegs out unless screwed to something. We don’t use them anymore. I mount FT’s chest height on the tree - ideally post width, but most trees will work. The sensitivity is very adjustable to allow for manufacturing variances. Some possums might not like to put their heads in, but most traps will require that. I find them very easy to set and work with. Yep, keep them above dog height. I often mount in multiples as their scent can attract more to the scene of the crime.
Rats can get into them, so we often pair them with a rat trap - I often use an A24 for the initial installation as it can quickly knockoff a bunch of rats. I don’t use the ALP (auto lure pumps) as I don’t think they’re cost effective unless not servicing the traps regularly. I just fill the hole in a used ALP with Nutella (or peanut butter). When kill rates go down it can go mouldy in the winter months (Auckland). If the Nutella is gone, then likely out of gas unless mice or insects have eaten it. Some mice get killed while others are too light. and don’t trigger it.
I consider the Trapinator its poor cousin. You can flip the kill bar over to adjust sensitivity, but it’s just not as refined and effective in my experience.
For rats we use Victors (don’t got for the cheap/weak ones) in wooden boxes which protects the bait from the elements. I often put the boxes up in the trees for ship rates which I think increases the catch rate a lot as they feel safe from predators up there. I put platforms on the front of the boxes to allow the rat to drop down from above and enter the box.
Otherwise I find a branch that will lead them into the box entrance. I initially used the Victors with metal tabs and put an almond on it, but then switched to the yellow tabs. Mice can clean them out, but I set them very close to triggering if that is a problem.
T-Rex’s are probably good too, but I think they’re more expensive. Easier/safer to set.
For mustelids, hedgehogs and Norway rats (neophobic and smart) I use DOC200/250s.
For wild cats , hedgehogs and mustelids we use the smart cages (Tāwhiti – Smart Cage – Predator Free Franklin) which are very effective, but being live capture cages, someone needs to be on hand, willing and able to despatch the catch with an air rifle or similar. They’re not dog proof, so they can possibly damage the trap or dog if they try to go it. I get an email for every catch, so there’s no need to check the traps on a schedule. Great to have some in the tool kit depending on your situation. With the right lure, it’s a doddle to catch possums in the smart cages too. Essential if you’re trying to cage those last predators or the hard-to-catch ones.
I’ve had limited results with the autolure pump (mayo mix) so I’m still working to figure out the best flavour to mix with the mayo. great for those locations further away with few predators though.
I haven’t used the AT220s
For the lure, fresh rabbit is easily my best for mustelids, cats and rats. I don’t use it specifically for rats, but I do catch them with it. Erayz for longer life and slightly less effective.
Ants can be a challenge with all baits in some places. I find Mortein ant sand an effective deterrent. I’ve yet to try Ripcord in the mayo mix, but concerned it might make it unpalatable.
For baits, we use pied piper bait stations for high rat populations (to avoid hoarding) and raised mini Philproofs for possums. Pest Off brody being easily the best bait for us. Almost all other baits have been useless in my experience. Double tap goes mouldy and I rarely see anything eating it.
You could use bits of wood at 45 degrees to trees.
Ah, of course! That’ll also make it much easier to relocate, just bolt it to an old length of fencepost or something and move it around areas where it looks like possums are active, leaning against a convenient tree. Thanks!
Have you ever tried coating the apple with cinnamon?
I’ve had way more success with it than plain apples. It keeps the apples firm longer, because the cinnamon reduces the evaporation-rate, and it keeps insects and birds away. Maybe 5% of the time mice/rats eat the cinnamon apples, and I’ve trapped a large ship rat in a Timms using it. A flour, icing sugar, and cinnamon blaze can be used.
I have had most of my rats the double doc150. I have also had ferrets, stoats, hedgehogs and cats. It is amazing how the big ferrets and cats squeeze in and hedgehogs can only go one way forward.
Regarding lures and the elements, I recommend trying Goodnature lures. They’re waterproof, mould-resistant, stay attractive to predators for months, and the levels of insect and invertebrate interference are low.1 sachet goes a long way, so it’s a cheap option, too.
The Blood lure, especially, has been very effective in my snap-traps, killing significant numbers of both rat species. For whatever reason, ants here ignore the Blood lure, so it’s worth trying if they’ve been a problem. The only downside to Blood lure is its texture, which makes it easier for predators to eat than PB or Nutella, for example. A mixed lure combining Blood lure (20%) with crunchy PB (80%) has been a big hit. It’s harder for predators to eat out of traps, it’s partially waterproof, the PB takes longer to go stale, and the predators here love the combination of smells and tastes.
Cheers.
Got one of the possums last night the very first time I used the cinnamon coating, this was one that had walked straight past the Timms trap line on multiple occasions before now. I’d chopped and changed a few other things as well so it’s not 100% certain it was only the cinnamon addition, but if it was then the effect is like magic.
Excellent! The smell of cinnamon must have been enough to stop it in its tracks to have a poke around. I’m glad that I mentioned it!
Here’s hoping it wasn’t the only cinnamon fan in the area.
Cheers.
Yep! Unfortunately I can’t edit the original list at the start of this post any more to change the comments on the Snap-E and D-Rat trigger plates, although there’s certainly rats down there because both the bait in the bait stations (held on a metal bar in a rat tunnel) and the possum feeder (loose in the case) vanish, the unexplained triggering with no catch may well have been a possum that bypassed all the other measures rather than the rats.
Have you thought of getting a trail camera to observe animal behaviour?
The blood lure doesn’t seem to be available any more? Lure & CO2 | Replenishment For A24 Trap | Goodnature USA
A24 Pre-feed Paste | Meat Lovers Formula · Goodnature
They’ve changed the lure’s name again! It was Stoat Lure, then Blood Lure, and now it’s Meat Lovers.
FYI, the lure doesn’t have a smell that humans can detect. I e-mailed Goodnature when I opened my first sachet, thinking that it must be a bad batch, but it’s designed to attract predators, not us!
It certainly did, resulting in a big spike in kills compared to PB, Nutella, etc. If you ever think that you’ve got on top of the predators in your area, switch to this lure and/or mayo, and you’ll quickly find out if there are any still around.